Trump’s Reflecting Pool Case COLLAPSES | David Hearn’s Lawyer Speaks

Tonight I interviewed Joshua Kolb, one of the attorneys representing former Olympian David Hearn, who was falsely accused by Donald Trump of vandalizing the Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool -- and then charged with a felony that could have sent him to prison for years.

Except now the government’s case has collapsed.

The Justice Department moved to dismiss its own indictment, acknowledging that the damage to the Reflecting Pool wasn’t caused by vandalism at all, but by shoddy work during the pool’s rushed renovation. Kolb also explained why Hearn’s lawyers believe prosecutors already had -- or should have had -- evidence showing that Hearn didn’t cause the damage before they ever went to the grand jury.

And then there’s the grand jury itself. We discussed the remarkable testimony of a government witness who initially said he couldn’t put a dollar value on the damage allegedly caused by Hearn -- an important problem because prosecutors needed more than $1,000 in damage to charge a felony. After a roughly 22-minute break, the witness came back and suddenly said the damage was well over $1,000.

Hearn’s lawyers are now fighting to have the case dismissed “with prejudice,” meaning the Trump administration could never bring these charges against him again. The next hearing is September 4.

We also broadened the discussion to Trump’s use of the Justice Department, the rule of law, birthright citizenship, Lisa Cook, the Kennedy Center, Trump’s improperly appointed U.S. attorneys, DOGE and USAID -- and why Kolb believes the courts are still providing an important check on some of the administration’s worst abuses.

00:00 Welcome & technical fun
02:08 Introducing Joshua Kolb and David Hearn’s case
03:10 How Hearn ended up facing a felony charge
06:30 The government moves to dismiss the case
08:31 Why the DOJ filing is so extraordinary
09:31 DOJ admits the damage wasn’t vandalism
10:32 Did prosecutors already have exculpatory evidence?
13:34 The problem with the government’s explanation
16:48 How the grand jury process works
18:48 The government witness and the $1,000 felony threshold
19:40 A 22-minute break -- and suddenly the damages exceed $1,000
20:19 Hearn’s lawyers seek the full grand jury record
22:50 Why “with prejudice” matters
24:03 What Hearn must prove to end the case permanently
27:17 Trump’s comments and the search for a scapegoat
31:21 A broader crisis for the rule of law
31:51 Birthright citizenship, Lisa Cook & other legal victories
32:37 Kennedy Center and other Democracy Defenders cases
34:30 Using the criminal justice system against political enemies
38:12 Democracy Defenders Fund’s three major priorities
40:03 DOGE, Elon Musk and the fight over USAID
41:47 The Supreme Court: terrible rulings, but important victories
43:28 The Kennedy Center fight
46:34 What happens next in David Hearn’s case
47:02 September 4 hearing
48:11 Can victims sue the federal government?
53:00 How David Hearn is doing now
56:13 Why Kolb still sees reason for hope
57:14 Fighting authoritarian backsliding
58:15 How do we stop this from happening again?
59:50 Joshua Kolb signs off